Friday, August 13, 2010

2010 Queen City Jamboree Preview

Below is the schedule for the 2010 Queen City Jamboree. This annual event is the kickoff to the high school football season in NH. Many of the top programs in the Manchester area compete in the event. It is a good way for fans to see many teams all at one time, and also for the teams to get one last tune-up before the regular season begins.

The QCJ will be held on Friday, August 27 at Gill Stadium in Manchester.

Schedule
4:30 PM: Salem vs. Goffstown
5:30 PM: Manchester West vs. Souhegan
6:30 PM: Manchester Memorial vs. Trinity
7:30 PM: Manchester Central vs. Timberlane
8:30 PM: Pinkerton vs. Bishop Guertin

There will also be a jamboree for freshmen teams the day before, on August 26. These games will also be held at Gill Stadium.

Schedule
4 PM: Manchester West vs. Merrimack
5 PM: Nashua North vs. Nashua South
6 PM: Exeter vs. Bishop Guertin
7 PM: Manchester Central vs. Pinkerton
8 PM: Manchester Memorial vs. Salem

My Thoughts
I know there probably won't be too many people that go to the freshman games other than parents. But from the hype that I've heard about Trevor Knight, I might just make the drive down to see him play. Knight is an incoming freshman quarterback, and is supposedly a natural and the real deal. He lives in Amherst, but will be attending Nashua South where he'll be able to play for his father Scott who is the head coach of the varsity team. The Purple Panthers have Keith Farkas coming back this year (poised for a BIG senior season) at QB. So one would assume that Knight will play freshman/JV ball this year. Then if he is as good as people say he is he would then be South's starting QB as a sophomore, giving the team 3 years of Farkas + 3 years of Knight = 6 straight years of top notch QB play. August 26 will be his first chance to prove himself at the high school level.

West has a Freshman Team?
One of the big stories last fall at the beginning of the football season was the status of the struggling West program. Despite the fact that they played in Division I, they didn't even have a JV team, ouch! Well apparently West still has a freshman team, since they'll be competing in the freshman jamboree on August 26. Perhaps the program had more kids tryout this year. If so that's good to hear!

Other Thoughts
Would have liked to see Salem vs. Souhegan instead of Salem/Goffstown and Souhegan/West. We saw both of these matchups last year and Salem and Souhegan won going away. It would be interesting to how Luks and McKenna hold up against a tougher defense...Pinkerton vs. BG should be fun. Last year the Cardinals beat the Astros 35-7 in week 1 of the season. Both teams graduate A LOT of talent though, especially BG. I'll be watching to see how Pinkerton uses Luke Somers. Somers has played RB/TE the past 2 years with Ryan Simpson as the team's QB. But before that Somers always played quarterback. Will he be Pinkerton's starter now that Simpson has graduated? Will he be the team's feature back now that star Eric Guinto has graduated? Or will the team use his blocking / pass catching abilities as a tight end? Only time will tell.

176 comments:

  1. Hype comming from out of amherst? That's not a suprise at all for years they try to hype their program but the real program comes out of Plymouth in that division hands down.

    ReplyDelete
  2. Regarding Amherst "hype" in the 1st comment . . . Souhegan is D-III and Plymouth is D-IV.

    ReplyDelete
  3. Thats because souhegan couldn't live up to the hype so instead of being able to beat plymouth they moved down to make themselves seem better.

    ReplyDelete
  4. BG lost way too much...they will be exposed early.

    ReplyDelete
  5. 10:23, with Plymouth being in D IV (4) and Souhegan is in D III (3) I'm not sure how Souhegan "moved down" because they couldn't compete with Plymouth.
    Plymouth moved down because the travel schedule is easier in D IV than D III.
    If you're going to criticize a program at least do it with facts

    ReplyDelete
  6. Travel? NH is one of the smallest states in the Union...please.

    ReplyDelete
  7. plymouth moved down not souhegan. souhegan would've thrashed plymouth last year. plymouths harsdest game was against laconia, and souhegan beat laconia 34-7

    ReplyDelete
  8. and souhegan lost to milford, and plymouth killed milford! yadayadayada

    ReplyDelete
  9. Plymouth's travel schedule in DIII would be Conval (1.5 hrs) SHS (1.5 hrs) Portsmouth(1hr 40 mins) Milford (1.5 hrs) etc. And those teams would all have to travel to plymouth every other year. Almost every trip would be near or over 100 miles. That adds up to more gas, more time paid to bus drivers, less parents able/willing to drive that far to see their kid play,

    ReplyDelete
  10. If you want to play with big boys and talk like a big boy then make an effort to play the big boys.

    ReplyDelete
  11. Plymouth move up - you play nobody, absolutely nobody. Travel is no excuse.

    BG move up - the fact you didn't when given the chance is mind boggling. If you did you would be playing at Stellos 7 times per year not including the playoffs - you would play both Nashua schools and you'd probably be back in the Turkey Day mix. Next time, do the right thing and move to D1 where you belong.

    Enough already about Plymouth. A nice little story in a nice little town. Nothing more, nothing less.

    ReplyDelete
  12. Trinity is playing Memorial this year?

    ReplyDelete
  13. First, nobody from Plymouth is talking "like a big boy". In fact, I've never seen any post here bragging about Plymouth. Someone mentioned that SHS moved down to make themselves look better. I pointed out that Plymouth was the team who moved down and I didn't want anyone to think it was because they were afraid of SHS (though SHS probably would have beaten them the past 2 years). Travel is not an EXCUSE.... it is a REASON. Unless you are willing to fuel up 2 buses and pay 2 people to drive them 3 or 4 hours (round trip) and sit through the game then I wouldn't say travel is just an excuse.

    ReplyDelete
  14. I can't even tell who 3:39 is even insulting.

    ReplyDelete
  15. Trinity petitioned up to play in DIV and I would bet they wanted to be in DIII. Trinity will have tough bus rides until the get into DIII. Pelham petitioned up from DV to play DIII for an easier, less costly transportation bill. If you bothered to look at the divisions its pretty easy to see that Divisions 1-3 are all teams below or close to below Concord and all teams north of concord are in DIV or lower.

    School buses get, on average, 7 MPG according American Bus Council. So for a 70 mile trip (which Plymouth and their home opponents would almost always EXCEED if plymouth was in DIII) It would cost close to 30 dollars in gas one way for one bus. Why wouldn't an AD look to save money for his travel budget. Its not "money hungry bus drivers"... its bus drivers who want to actually be paid for driving. Plus, Freshman games are on Thursday and JV games on Monday, both school nights. If the game starts at 4 or 5 and ends around 7 the road team gets back to the school around 9-9:30 (after leaving right after school, if not getting out slightly early). They still have to eat dinner, and do homework/study.
    For the record, I don't even like Plymouth. But they moved down to save money, plain and simple.

    ReplyDelete
  16. Plymouth plays nobody in the division that they chose to move down to. If you want to start talking about how great you are, play in a division where you could go up against the Souhegans and the Portsmouths. If you are so good and wanted to prove it, a couple of easy fund raisers would handle the increased transportation costs and you would be fine. The fact is that for a team like Plymouth, it would be a double hardship - it would cost more money to get their butts handed to them by much stronger teams.

    ReplyDelete
  17. Also for the record, all small town's administrators have instructed AD to find cost cutting ways...if that means moving down a division then that's what it needs to be. Other than that, lose a program which I know has been thrown around. No AD wants to cut any program. Once you lose it, it is very difficult to get it back.

    ReplyDelete
  18. I seriously doubt there is a single human being in Plymouth that, in the last say, 10 years, even THOUGHT of cutting Plymouth Football. ESPECIALLY in the town administration. It's the only reason anyone knows Plymouth is even there.

    ReplyDelete
  19. Plymouth propaganda, remember that Milford's starters were all suspended for partying and you played the JV team. Then remember that Souhegan played Milford with 10+ key players out. Then remember that when healthy Souhegan blew out a full strength Milford team just as much as Plymouth did a JV Milford team. Then remember Souhegan CRUSHED Laconia 37-7 with the only score on a freak Souhegan breakdown before half. How'd Plymouth fair? Oh, right. 14-7. And don't pull the playoff score against Laconia on me here because they had numerous kids either get injured or quit on the team (literally and figuratively) according to a source in Laconia.

    Remember that just as Plymouth's FR and JV teams started losing to Souhegan as Souhegan's three strongest classes ever reached high school that Lenehan ran away. Oh, yeah he also turned down numerous Thanksgiving invites. FACT.

    ReplyDelete
  20. Is it really out of the realm of possibility the Plymouth chose not to play the turkey day games because they didn't want to drive 2 hours on Thanksgiving? A Plymouth/SHS turkey day game would be a waste for all involved. A meaningless game played in the morning of a family holiday is dumb enough (SHS's reason for not beating Merrimack by more, a reason I completely agree with) without adding a 2-hour drive.
    P.S: I STILL DON'T THINK PLYMOUTH IS A GREAT TEAM. I still think SHS is better and has been for 3 years. Re-read every post in the article and NO WHERE does anyone say Plymouth is a great team. When you say "You played the JV Team", I'm not a Plymouth fan and don't have a child who attends a NH high school. I have little doubt SHS would beat Plymouth in a game. Its just a fact that travel played an important role in Plymouth moving down. Same reason Pelham moved from D-V to D-III.

    ReplyDelete
  21. Jeremy -

    Any chance you can start a thread allowing players/fans to post scrimmage days/times? I bet a lot of people would like to check out some pre-season action if given the chance.

    I know BG is at Memorial this AM and at North Saturday AM.

    Keep up the good work!

    ReplyDelete
  22. the dover/ st thomas scrimmage doesnt look like the exciting match it was going to be... ive heard that sta's two best defensive players, baxter and pearl, are hurt

    ReplyDelete
  23. Salems moon surfaced practice field is claiming knees and ankles at a high rate this year.

    ReplyDelete
  24. Unfortunate injury incident at Nashua North. I hope the kid turns out alright.

    http://www.wmur.com/news/24656800/detail.html?treets=man&tid=2659218882813&tml=man_12pm&tmi=man_12pm_1_11000108172010&ts=H

    ReplyDelete
  25. Real sad story, keep this kid in your prayers!

    ReplyDelete
  26. Here is a posting from a Memorial parent in the Nashua Telegraph on the BG at Memorial scrimmage from today:

    What a beautiful morning it was today to watch Manchester Memorial’s first scrimmage against Bishop Guertin. From the tone of Coach Tony’s voice, it wasn’t all that fun to be a BG Cardinal.

    It was obvious from the start (sorry for my slight bias here) that the Crusaders were out to prove a point. This year’s juniors and seniors have been a part of a losing football club for a few years now, with each one getting a little better. A new offensive coordinator from Nashua South will prove to be a huge asset to the Crusaders game.

    I was surprised at the undersized line on defense for BG. Memorial’s offensive line towered over them. Their offense and defense looked green, only one week into the season. Their runningbacks were, as always, pretty impressive, but had a hard time penetrating the Crusaders line, and coughed up the ball too much.

    The Crusaders, playing on their home field, were full of “piss and vinegar,” as my mother would say. But, by the end of the scrimmage, there were many players dragging. All the work coordinating the offense surely shows, and now they just need some more conditioning.

    I look forward to watching both these teams in their perspective divisions. BG does have some work to do, to live up to the previous team’s efforts. And, Memorial will be out to prove they can compete with the big guys.

    ReplyDelete
  27. forget the 34 seniors,guertins biggest loss was coach phillips.

    ReplyDelete
  28. I do agree with Aug 16 10AM comment - the turkey day game is a total waste of time and is a distraction to the winter sports teams that share atheletes as the football seson drags on and on for a "game" that has no bearing on playoffs or a state title. Even if you win a title or play for it - the turkey day game is played a full two weeks after a champ has been decided. If we are talking about tight athletic budgets and how there is no money to handle the costs, then the turkey day game is the first cut in my mind. I am no fan of Plymouth, but when it comes to travel/costs to play a Thanksgiving day game they are smart to not do it.

    ReplyDelete
  29. 9:55
    What ever happened to playing football simply because its fun? I just wanna play and 1 extra game this year is great. Pretty much every player on our team is looking forward to playing this thanksgiving. I am a senior and Salem has never played on thanksgiving since I been there. We always play D2 games that don't count, whats the diff?

    ReplyDelete
  30. I grew up playing in a T-Day game called the "City Championship" played in front of 5000+ at Holman Stadium. At BG we were huge underdogs to a unified Nashua HS and lost most of the time but I will never forget the experience. It was absolutely great.

    Who is Salem playing on Turkey Day this year?

    ReplyDelete
  31. Salem is playing Lawrence High School at Veterans Memorial Stadium in Lawrence Mass.

    ReplyDelete
  32. I would say that there were not 5000 plus fans at your turkey day exhibition game at Holman Stadium - a bit of an exaggeration there - but something that would go a long way towards making the turkey day exhibition game viable in my mind is to say that all basketball and hockey practices can begin the day after the state championship football games are played. Varsity basketball and hockey players would then after that day move into their practices with their winter teams. In other words, after the state title games are played, there should be no "football responsibility" placed on an athlete unless he chooses to play in the exhibition. And basketball and hockey tryouts and workouts should begin immediately after the state title games are played

    ReplyDelete
  33. 1:28 - what are you talking about? If a school decides to play a Turkey Day game it is on the schedule and they play it with their entire team. What is you gripe? Regarding Nashua Turkey Day attendance prior to the Nashua split, the game drew incredibly well. The public versus Catholic rivalry created a lot of interest.

    ReplyDelete
  34. There was an story in the Telegraph a year or two ago about the T-day games. The writer said there were crowds of that size. The story included a picture of the overflow crowd at Holman.

    ReplyDelete
  35. 1:28

    Class L or Division I basketball practices always start on the Monday after Thanksgiving so a game on that day will have no effect on the players taking part.

    ReplyDelete
  36. Actually they moved all the start dates back last year and one of the reasons that they will not let Basketball start earlier is the football games. It is silly Football should be over by then in my opinion.

    ReplyDelete
  37. Oh boy...the reason why the basketball teams can't start sooner is because of football!! Try cramming tryouts, initial workouts where you put your sets in, and two scrimmages to see where you are in the two weeks before your first scheduled NHIAA game. Also - division 2 basketball begins this year on Dec. 17 (1st game). That is ridiculously late and it is because of football. It may be the case that practice "always starts" on the Monday after Thanksgiving but there is no good reason for that at all. If you don't make the state playoffs and you play in a turkey day exhibition, it is a month between your last two games and basketball or hockey cant work out until you are done that's my problem 5:13

    ReplyDelete
  38. No Class L has been starting on the Monday after Thanksgiving for at least the last 15 years, you may have the reason right but Class L has always started on that day.

    ReplyDelete
  39. You are nutz - Football should be year round!!!

    ReplyDelete
  40. Salem would absolutely smoke Lawrence.

    ReplyDelete
  41. Just like in the Union Leader. The topic is the Queen City preview and the Plymouth bashing begins. Why doesn't someone ask the administration up there why Plymouth went to D4. Your answer would be based on the population numbers at the school and its continuing decline. I think you will find it in the middle 600s now. Transportation is a concern but not a major decision making issue. Plymouth has five away Friday night games this year in four different parts of the state.

    The Plymouth and Souhegan JVs enjoyed a healthy game relationship but my memories while attending those last few years are much different than those constantly put out here. Neither side crushed the other or dominated. Home team won out unlike the beginning of the series where Plymouth held a slight advantage with their own 40 plus game winning streak in the beginning of this decade. In fact the last JV game between the two was a 34-28 game with Plymouth leaving the ball inside the Souhegan 5 yard line as time ran out. The Sabers had a boy with about 200 yards receiving and the McAuliffe kid from Plymouth had about 200 yards rushing. Not what I would describe as a crushing or dominating win but an outstanding game.

    Interest is not very high for a Thanksgiving game in Plymouth regardless of its opponent. There has been total speculation printed here and in the Union Leader, simple truth is no one want to extend the football season into the winter seasons. No other reason.

    Editors take note -- This is suppose to be about Football in New Hampshire. Don't allow this constant mud raking and name calling. If you want to know about Plymouth go ask them, be journalists. It is much harder to demean someone after you know them. Three years of the same grand standing is getting old.

    ReplyDelete
  42. there's no mud raking or name calling going on here. don't be so sensitive, 10:31.

    ReplyDelete
  43. 10:31, you refer to the second to last jv game. the last to frosh games and the last jv game were very decisive to souhegan. plymouth didn't have the talent to beat souhegan last year, 2008, or this year. not even close. the well dried up and chuck went into hiding. admit it.

    ReplyDelete
  44. Kids that would of went to souhegan now go to bishop guertin for the class of 2013

    ReplyDelete
  45. Guys check this out. This is the best football video that I have ever seen.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AlXDo5WhQXI

    ReplyDelete
  46. WOW I hate the song but the coaches speech really hit home with a argument that was being talked about on this blog the other day. Someone on Milford was saying that the boys could be satisfied with last year and be more worried about college and prep school and that could lead to not winning in March. I am not from Milford but if I was I would ask my coach to use this type of speech early in the year and maybe again in March to remind the boys that you only get one senior year and how special this time of your life is. Good video, still cannot stomach country music though.

    ReplyDelete
  47. I agree, Crazy good video. Music, not so much. Very inspirational, gives ya chills.

    ReplyDelete
  48. In no way is the person from Milford saying they are content with just one title. All the Milford kids no that everytime they step on the floor its history and pride and to think for one minute they won't be trying just as hard is crazy. They know they are a year older and a year better but your going to have to beat them on the court this year if you want a title because you won't beat them by words on this site.

    ReplyDelete
  49. Did the video remind anyone, besides me, of the poster who says, over and over, that a certain team's Thanksgiving day game against their bordering town, the last game for the seniors with their teammates was "meaningless"? I guess the coaches in the video nead a lesson on the meaning of football, huh?

    ReplyDelete
  50. jeremy are you going to the st thomas/ dover scrimmage tomorrow? its at 930 in dover

    ReplyDelete
  51. Actually the last game would be just as meaningful if not more if it was played 2 weeks earlier.

    ReplyDelete
  52. north-bg 10 am stellos,saturday.

    ReplyDelete
  53. Plymouth did lose to last years group of Souhegan seniors as freshman. I believe that they also lost last year to Merrimack Valley Freshman. I guess that in 4 years MV will be a dominating force in New Hampshire because they beat the Plymouth Freshman. Get a life people let the kids play where the administration makes them play. 600 kids in Plymouth to 1200 in souhegan, and it is still a good game. Preperation beats talent most of the time. I for one would like to see Plymouth and Souhegan play each other but it wont happen. Look out for MV!

    ReplyDelete
  54. For 5:41, who clearly doesn't get the meaning or correct use of the word "context", allow me to help. When discussing turkey day football exhibitions, the "context" of calling them "meaningless" is from the standpoint of division play that would help or harm a team's chances of making the state playoffs and winning a state championship.

    An NFL exhibition game has "meaning" from the standpoint of practicing execution, player evaluation, etc., but has absolutely no "meaning" in the standings that are kept to determine playoff qualifiers and an eventual Super Bowl Champion.

    Now, back to the point. Why should a school's basketball program only get 2-3 weeks to run tryouts, establish off and def sets, and have 2 scrimmages to evaluate because they are waiting around for their football team to play a "meaningless" (remember context!!) turkey day exhibition?

    ReplyDelete
  55. Souhegan's enrollment is 890, but nice try out threre from Plymouth. It's a consensus in the state that Souhegan was a top 3 team and would have rolled Plymouth. Just be happy Lenehan ran away so that you can keep your streak.

    ReplyDelete
  56. 9:50
    Where did you see the word, context, misused or misunderstood? It's not in the 5:41 post, and it's not used anywhere else. How can you tell that 5:41 "clearly doesn't understand"?
    And the NFL is for MONEY! If they weren't well paid, you wouldn't see grown men showing up for a meaningless game (remember "context").

    ReplyDelete
  57. Nothing against Souhegan. I don't mean that they are not top three, but to be fair, if we talk consensus, they were consensus top six.

    ReplyDelete
  58. to 5:41 and 1:48 Ok cut through the semantics - NH HS turkey day exhibitions that happen at least 2 weeks after an NHIAA state champion has been decided means nothing, and keeps winter sports teams from preparing properly.

    ReplyDelete
  59. Forget the 5,000 fans for Nashua/BG on Thansgiving. Some of us are old enough to remember closer to 8,000. The whole city showed up. This may be hard for newbies to fathom, but it's true.

    ReplyDelete
  60. Souhegan 1:38. Frankly your envy of Plymouth and overly ambitious sense of entitlement have no place here. Badmouthing a person you don't even know. Rumors are manufactured by fools. The games are played on the field not in some made up simulation. Preparation and coaching along with taking advantage of the situation on the field wins games. Coaching experience put players in the position to win. Does Fair Catch Free Kick sound familiar. Have a great season there in Souhegan. We will be watching to see if this years team can live up to the boosting of the past few years.

    ReplyDelete
  61. A High School seniors last ever football game with his team mates is far from meaningless. You sir, have never played the sport. And if you played, you did not enjoy it.

    ReplyDelete
  62. The Pressure is on for Salem.

    http://sports.espn.go.com/boston/teams/preps/news/story?page=netop10fb

    ReplyDelete
  63. How did the North vs. BG scrimmage go?

    There is no such thing as a meaningless HS football game. Believe me, once it's over you will understand. I further agree that the person writing that Turkey Day games are meaningless exhibitions never played the game.

    ReplyDelete
  64. For the tenth time 11:33, you do not understand the context of the term meaningless - I feel a little sorry for you that you dont have the capacity to grasp it...but in the spirit of making every attempt to educate our fellow man, I will try again.

    It is an exhibition. It means "nothing" with regards to determining who the playoff qualifiers and the champions are. And if the exhibition was not played, then either the last game of the season, the last playoff game, or the state championship game would be the "High School Seniors last game with his teammates" and would have much more "meaning" to them than the exhibition because if you lose your season and career is over. Wow...unbelievable.

    And as for Plymouth, pretty easy to keep a winning streak alive when you play who you play. There are teams that play up division wise that are smaller enrollment wise (Pelham in basketball is a good example and there are others)...you don't do that and that tells me something. You would be middle of the pack in Souhegan and Portsmouth's division and you know it.

    ReplyDelete
  65. Right but emotions would be higher and even more intense knowing that winning your last game was a playoff game. Not a game that is 2 weeks after the championship game is decided. You want a last game, play for the title. Not for the Holidays!

    ReplyDelete
  66. How is Football different than any other sport?

    ReplyDelete
  67. Does anyone know why Salem vs. Souhegan was not matched up in the Queen City Jamboree? It would have been a better match up than Salem vs. Goffstown and Souhegan vs. West.

    ReplyDelete
  68. Souhegan doesn't feel the need to be envious of a team that can play the vaunted defenses of Kingswood and Merrimack Valley every year, Plymouth. Souhegan had such better teams the past two years, and will again this year. Ask anyone outside of Plymouth. Granted this year doesn't have the talent of the last two, but they have a large senior class with good role players that have played together since elementary school. They will still win D-III while being the smallest school in D-III enrollment-wise (you have no excuse to be in D-IV). And the free kick team you mentioned was far weaker than the past two Souhegan teams whereas that Plymouth team was much stronger than the Plymouth squad of today.

    I just love how Lenehan runs away when his talent well dries up and Souhegan's three strongest classes ever come through. Plymouth's best player last year was McAuliffe. Where'd he go? Oh ya, Plymouth State. Souhegan had seven kids go on to play college ball last year, a D1 commit, two D2 commits, a D3 commit with a full ride from UNH left on the table, and three more at D3 including Jeremy's number one QB last year, Petropulos. And they weren't just talent-laden. These kids had also been playing together since they were using training wheels.

    Just be glad you're in a division where you're assured a 1000 year rein of power where you play nobody. Play at least one good team a year, will you?

    ReplyDelete
  69. 8:53
    I am 11:33 and that was my first post on the subject. This is what I can tell you. I played back in the day. There was a turkey day game. That last game provided my best memories, it made that 'family' day very special. Now many many years later my son is playing. He has heard my turkey day stories. He has heard about my extended family making the trip to my games. He has heard about the day long celebrations. He felt that he was missing out because while he heard about these 'meaningless' turkey day games going on around him, he had none to look forward to. He wanted this game for me. He wanted me to get up that morning, bundle up with my coffee, my brothers, my sisters, my parnets, his cousins, my friends and extended friends to go watch this game. He wanted me to relive my turkey day games. Well, last year he played for the state championship and won. It wss a great experience as a father. When it was all over, he said... "I wish we played a turkey day game dad" and I echoed, "Me too son, me too". So fast forward to this year when we found out that Salem High School is playing on Thanksgiving day. All that my son has been talking about since finding out is this game. He wants this Thanskgiving day game to be a great game. He wants Lawrence High to be competitive. He wants it to snow. He basically wants it to include all of the memories that he has been hearing me talk about. He has NOT ONCE. NOT A SINGLE time to this point mentioned anything about repeating for the title. He has not mentioned his BG opening day matchup. He is excited about the turkey day game.

    You sir, are the one that does not understand the 'context' of meaningless.

    ReplyDelete
  70. 8:53
    Then if a game is scheduled between teams that no longer can make the playoffs, neither team should show up? 11:33 has a "grasp" that I agree with.

    ReplyDelete
  71. When BG and Nashua squared off "back in the day" it was far from meaningless. It was bitter, angry and very chippy. Yes, Nashua won about 90% of the time but they were supposed to win.

    BG showed up, played hard and every once in a while shocked everyone by keeping it close until the end of actually winning. No question, those days are gone forever but the game drew huge interest and was highly emotional. Far from meaningless.

    I cannot comment on other Turkey Day matchups because most are in their infancy most do not feature traditional rivals. If BG cannot get back into the Nashua game, I would like to see Exeter and Winny play a T-Day game. I wonder if those communities would find it meaningless?

    ReplyDelete
  72. 12:39 - all you said may be true, BUT...

    Your turkey day game and the pleasant soliloquy that you provided about it had NO MEANING with regards to determining the playoff slots, seeding, finalists, and state football champions of New Hampshire. That was the "context" of the posts I have made, and again it is an absolute shame that winter sports teams that share athletes are not able to begin their quest for a championship until that exhibition game is over with. Would a top level baseball team that shared athletes with basketball be appreciative about not getting to start workouts until two weeks after the state title game was played becuase the basketball team decided to scrimmage their neighbor on March 29 in the "Spring Classic" and practice right up to that point? - I don't think so and you know they wouldn't also.

    ReplyDelete
  73. Why does Salem get to play such an easy game?

    ReplyDelete
  74. 2:48
    You are so caught up with 'tomorrow' and 'state championships' that you miss the point entirely. If there was a single part of High School atheletics that could be considered 'meaningless;, it's the titles themselves.

    ReplyDelete
  75. Sanborn beat Pelham the other day in a scrimmage 35-0. Towards the end Sanborn put in all of their freshmen. then the Pelham coach took his team and left before the game was even over!

    ReplyDelete
  76. yeah pelham is not good the same thing happened at monadnock

    ReplyDelete
  77. It isn't about just being the title game. It is culmination of your entire career being played in one game. There is no reason for a game after the season to be played so late. No other sport does this why should football. Think about it guys sure it is a game that many players look forward to but in the end it is just a way to play one more game. Putting it on a Holiday to me is a perfect reason for it's demise. Holidays are about family. Get the season over with before the playoffs, period.

    ReplyDelete
  78. In fact the senior games for basketball are done the day after the championship games for that reason. To allow Spring sports to start as soon as possible. Right now college basketball starts practice on October 15th. Currently high school ball in NH starts after Thanksgiving.. This is the easiest argument ever. Football should be over after the titles are decided.

    ReplyDelete
  79. As always a Souhegan players(?), coaches(?)or player(?)out to demean another school or team. Tell you what provide proof of you accusations or drop it. Would want to start demeaning your coach for misrepresenting the truth. Demeaning Plymouth State now? Hope you boys are as successful with the books as they will need to be on the field. We know the three going on to play at the next level from Plymouth will be.

    Speaking of vaulted schedules -- you certainly had a hard time runing up the score on those Pembrokes, Starks, Goffstowns, Milfords... Got to pad them individual stats. Preparation is the key or have you forgotten about those upset losses to Stark and Milford. Again good luck, humility is a hard thing to learn

    ReplyDelete
  80. Plymouth & Laconia or Souhegan & Portsmouth. After that DIV is tougher from 3-10 then DIII. So who is playing the easier schedual? In crossover games DIV is something like 17-3 the past two years. Plymouth is in a tougher division, and has only lost to souhegan twice. Preperation beats talent! Plain and simple!

    ReplyDelete
  81. NH Sportspage does not agree with you. Go read that article. They say you took the easy way out. Souhegan playing up and Plymouth playing as easy a schedule as possible. You may get to 66 wins it says this year. If the people on here are not worth listening to maybe you should talk to the guy at NH Sportspage for calling you out also.

    ReplyDelete
  82. I seriously doubt that any player of any sport whose team had won a state championship would call it meaningless, and most of them would cite the drive for a championship and to win in general (by the rules and with class) as the driving force behind what motivates them to play and compete at a high level. Ask Plymouth - if it wasn't about the championships and the winning for them they would have played a division up or played many more games against better competition. Plymouth does not play in a "better division" than D3 as posted earlier, and if "the things that are meaningless are the state titles" as posted earlier, Plymouth would be playing against the highest caliber competition possible, and don't give me that line about the transportation costs in "this economy" - money could easily be raised to handle that.

    Time for Plymouth to play somebody - night in and night out. Let's see what you've got after you do that, Coach.

    ReplyDelete
  83. Souhegan, in a rebuilding year after back to back state titles, plays @ Londonderry, @ Portsmouth, and then hosts Manchester Central.

    Plymouth, who do you play? You had a chance to make a statement about the type of team you are and you didn't take advantage of it.

    ReplyDelete
  84. 8:57
    State titles have much more meaning for adults than players. The more meaning it has to a parent, the more it has to the player. Just in case you were not aware, the Plymouth players have absolutely nothing to do with scheduling.

    ReplyDelete
  85. Salem is going to be scary good this year. Cannone has an amazing arm and with Jerkickson and Jauques at the RB postition they will be hard to stop.

    BG- Guertin is always the best team in the state. They lost over 30 seniors so it'll be interesting to see how they do.
    They seem scared to join the D-I crowd. Probs to Exeter for moving up to D-I this year, they'll be exciting to watch.

    Plymouth is overrated. Match them up with Salem, BG, South, North, PA, Exeter, Souhegan...anyone in D-1 or D-2 (besides spaulding and they'll go down)

    Souhegan looks promising again. They beat up on Timberlane and held their own again North in a scrimmage last week.

    Timberlane is the "Black Horse" in D-II this year. Nick/Nate Lawerence carry huge weights on their shoulders. Jared DiOrio (#8?) is going to be a lot of fun to watch this year. They lost a lot on defense but look promising as well. Lost by one point to state champs Salem last year.

    Pinkerton lost their RB (Ginto?) and standout QB in Ryan Simpson. Word is they have a sophomore as Simpson's replacement..

    ReplyDelete
  86. jeremy are you going to the pelham scrimmage at st thomas tomorrow?

    ReplyDelete
  87. Exeter had to move up to D-1 because of its enrollment. They were locked into D-2 the last two years because of enrollment. Bill Ball is a fine coach and not one to duck a challenge. BG said no to petitioning up to D-1 and then changed its mind and said it would petition up, but it was too late.

    Pelham went up two divisions D-5 to D-3 for travel purposes, but would have been better off football wise in D-4.

    ReplyDelete
  88. I think BG actually tried to petition up, but the spot went to Exeter, because they actually HAD to.

    ReplyDelete
  89. BG got beat up by memorial this week..or is that not true?

    Also, yes Exeter had to move up, and they should have. Bill Ball is a great coach and has a very good program over in Exeter.

    ReplyDelete
  90. BG was asked to move up to D1 and they said No. They were asked twice and Corbin extended the deadline to petition and TJ still said No.

    ReplyDelete
  91. BG was not good against Memorial but better against North. But, they lost a ton and their defense is very young.

    ReplyDelete
  92. BG tied Memorial in the scrimmage. I also heard the Memorial beat Soughegan in their scrimmage.

    ReplyDelete
  93. There is nothing less meaningful than a scrimmage. I went to Salem's scrimmage. They ran Fedrick twice and Jacques 4 times. Then they watched from the sidelines. Cannone didn't play much either. Same goes for the linemen/backers. I guess you could try and guage something from the ten vanilla plays that they run.

    ReplyDelete
  94. went to timberlane/memorial scrimmage today. they played 1 v 1's for a majority of the day. Timberlane looked real strong on both sides of the football. Memorial did well with their no huddle offense but couldnt find the endzone. I believe the final "score" was 21-0 in favor of Timberlane. (there was no scoreboard)

    ReplyDelete
  95. Salem Winnacunnet Scrimmage today. All that I can say about Salems offense is WoW!!. These guys can score a million different ways. Fedrick is going to have a tough time winning Mr. football judging by the way that Jacques is running. Jacques scored 2, Fedrick scored 2, one through the air, Lorenz scored two, Cannone threw about 4 Tds, he loves Lorenz and the other TEs. It seemed as if Salem could have scored at will. They ran a plain and simple offense and scored on average 3-4 times during thier ten play drives. Fedrick had one run where he shook off about 4 tackles, he is strong. Salems defense wasn't bad, but needs a little work. There were many many no gain plays for Winnacunnet, but they did manage to score once on each of thier 10 play drives and then one at the end. Had it been a real game though, with 3 downs, it may have been a different story. They did score on a long broken run and an interception. The real story is Jacques. He may never see a college snap, but he has a shot of being the best HS RB ever in NH. He is showing his worth on defense also. The long TD run for Winny came with him watching from the sides.

    ReplyDelete
  96. 4:48, you forget about Sean Jellison much too quickly. There never was one like him and never will be again in this state.

    Also I heard Souhegan played North evenly, destroyed Timberlan, and that Timberlane blasted Memorial. I severely doubt Souhegan lost there's to Memorial. I'd say that likely falls under the category of being false info.

    ReplyDelete
  97. Souhegan did do very well against Timberlan and held there own against North. Timberlane did blast Memorial, truth.
    Souhegan would crush Memorial.

    ReplyDelete
  98. 9:34
    I watched Jellison run, he does not even come close to what I saw today in either Jacques or Fedrick. Go catch a game this year then judge.

    ReplyDelete
  99. so how can a player that never touches a college field have a chance of being a better player than a player who will start for a D1 program this year?

    ReplyDelete
  100. It is very simple to be the best running back a NH High School has ever seen production wise and just not have the tools to play in college. The kid is all of 5'6" 160lbs. This has also happened many times where the best college player (Heisman) does not have the tools for the pros. It's more ocmmon than you may think. Jacques could run circles around Fedrick this year, win Mr. Football and repeat as Gatorade player of the year... in the end, guys like Fedrick and Jellison will get the college nod. That does NOT make them better HS backs than Jacques.

    ReplyDelete
  101. His lack of size is a argument for him not being the best ever. While his stats show he may have a great season there are holes in his game with his lack of size and strength. You can say he is the best open field runner or something but to say he is better than a kid that went to college for free and plays big minutes is crazy. You cannot write off his lack of size and call him the greatest.

    ReplyDelete
  102. Jellison was only 5-9 and 175 lbs as a senior at Souhegan. He also ran a laser timed 4.42 at the College Park (Penn State) Nike Football Training Camp going into his Senior year (compare to Fedrick's 4.7, and Fedrick is faster than Jacques according to track times). He had 2,020 yards and 41 TD's in his JR season alone while playing A HALF OF FOOTBALL EACH WEEK!!!! Jacques had one good season as a Junior, Jellison had 4 SUPERB seasons on varsity as a starter and ownes EVERY rushing record in NH for season, game, and career. I've seen both play, and let me say again that there will never be another Sean Jellison. Not only was he fast and tough, but he had the most incredible field vision I've ever seen in a HS runner (in NH or MA). He could take a play with nowhere to go and cut back across the field four times for 6. I'm sorry but I don't see that with Jacques. Jellison never got caught from behind. Jacques gets caught with regularity. And 10:04, Jellison WAS the best open field runner of all time. You can't argue with 103 TDs and over 5,000 career yards. 11:38, I'm sorry but you're either extremely biased or have lost sight of reality in some small way. Jacques and Fedrick combined don't compare to Sean Jellison and never will. I'm sorry but it's just the truth. Again, the kid got 2,020 yards in a 12 game season where he only played a half of football each week, if that. I also think if I recall correctly that he tweaked his hammie toward the end of the season, which slowed him down and haunted him his SR year as a reoccuring thing.

    ReplyDelete
  103. 10:36 AM
    You are leaving out one important point. His team did not play ANY great competition. I am not saying he is not the best, I am only saying we will never really know.

    ReplyDelete
  104. 10:36
    I'm not sure which Jacques you watched. I have NEVER seen him get caught from behind (or Fedrick either for that matter) and you basically described Jacques in describing Jellison. I saw Jacques yesterday make at least 5 cuts on his way to the endzone. I saw this all last season too. If Fedrick or 1/2 of Jacques ever competed in D3 for an entire season they probably would have broken all of his records and every other record across the nation. Lets see when this season is over who people think was the best HS back ever in NH for a single season. And yes, there is quite a drop for D1/D2 to D3 in the overall competition, quite a drop. That factors in. For HS football it's not about 40s, Verticle Leaps etc... its about production. If you want to call Jellison or the Manchester guys the best college backs to ever come out of NH you will find no argument here, but we are strictly talking HS Football games, nothing beyond senior year.

    ReplyDelete
  105. Those of you who have never seen him, here is a clip of Jacques at the Winnacunnet Scrimmage.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWuUo4kbMtk

    ReplyDelete
  106. And here is a clip of what will probably be a common event with Cannone and Lorenz

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZxXHwgDrC94

    ReplyDelete
  107. no need to study game films of salem,just let this guy keep showing their formations that they run out of and pass out of.I am sure coach gati loves this dad.

    ReplyDelete
  108. Yeah, these two links will surely sink Salem. If you are interested, you can find the Entire playbook on CSN New England in the form of the D1 Title game. That should really cause problems.

    ReplyDelete
  109. haha 3:35 you haven't watched Salem much. The Formation that you see in both of those plays is one of only two that they use. No Secrets there.

    ReplyDelete
  110. I do not see the Jacques kid having as much explosive burst as Jellison. If he did UNH would be calling. Jellison was very small also and UNH seen his ability to make people miss and hit holes so quick that they took a chance. I may be wrong but I doubt UNH is.

    ReplyDelete
  111. Sorry guys, 3:16 is not Lorenz. It is a different TE. I will identify him and correct it.

    ReplyDelete
  112. who is tremorsnh?? if you were at the game can you get me a copy of the film?

    ReplyDelete
  113. 5:24
    First I must admit that I thought that you were referring to 2010 Jellison, I have never seen the older one play. Second, 5'9" is huge huge difference from 5'6". There are quite a few 5'9" RBs in D1.

    ReplyDelete
  114. The TE on the 3:16 is Jared Matthews, Jakes Brother.

    ReplyDelete
  115. Yes, the D-III of today is weak, but the old D-III from the early 2000s was arguably stronger than D-II in much the same way as D-IV is arguably stronger than D-III nowadays. Back then Plymouth could play with anybody in the state, Kennett was a legit power, Milford had Mack and a state championship, and Souhegan had Jellison, Verney, Conti, and of course, Lapham. The top 4-5 teams in D-III back then provided TREMENDOUS competition. Don't let the amount of Roman numerals after the D throw you off. 5-10 years ago D-III was extremely deep with Plymouth, Souhegan, and Kennett (arguably Milford as well one or two years) being right up there with the top teams in the state.

    Getting over 2000 yards and 41 TD's in a half of football each week with an injury towards the end of the season hampering you as a 175 lbs RB is EXTREMELY impressive. Jacques and Fedrick could never do that, I'm sorry.

    There will never be another Sean Jellison. Remember, Jellison started as a Frosh over an incumbent starter at RB and dominated the state for four long years. Jacques? He gets 35 carries a game to get 1800 yards playing four quarters with the most talented team in NH. Jellison? He was lucky to get 10 carries a game. The only problem for the defense was that four of those ten would be first quarter touchdowns.

    Actually, I saw Jacques get caught from behind twice at the QC Jamboree his JR year against Goffstown and in the championship game numerous times. Jellison's laser-timed 4.42 NEVER got caught, and rarely touched. But you're right, it's not just 40s. It's about production. Jellison is the most prolific, productive back in NH state history, and it was all done on a half of football each week and an injury plagued senior season/end of junior year with hamstring issues.

    7:14, if you had seen Sean Jellison you'd forget all about Jacques and Fedrick. And let's be honest, a 5'9 175 white RB from D-III New Hampshire is not getting D1 college looks because of his 3 extra inches of height. The 2 or 3 tenths of a second in the forty are though. And the field vision. And the shear football ability.

    Finally, each and every one of Schubert's bruisers and burners in the backfield that went on to the likes of Maryland and UMass were much better HS backs than Jacques and Fedrick. Don't be so short-sighted and Salem player/fan/parent/coach biased.

    ReplyDelete
  116. Fedrick has two more BIG seasons to improve. Just cause he didn't immediately start as a freshman, on a much better team, does not mean he will not ultimately be better.

    ReplyDelete
  117. Jacques is definitely more football fast then Fedrick, Fedrick is just utterly beastly.

    ReplyDelete
  118. Trinity-Memorial friday to get an idea of who Central will play on thanksgiving haha.

    ReplyDelete
  119. 7:59
    Jacques as part of a 3 man backfield averaged only 19 (far far from 35) carries a game, over 8.6 ypc and Jerickson 12 carries for over 9 ypc. Not sure why you are hating on them, but you shouldn't make stuff up to make an argument. No one catches them from behind. You do not even know what I am trying to say since you keep bringing up college and this conversation has nothing to do with college. I could care less about college. I'll tell you what. For your sake and since I really don't care, I will say that Jacques has a CHANCE this year to be the best single season D1 HS back that NH has ever seen while still being vastly inferior to the RB that you are plugging. Is that better? You have shown me the error of my ways. Either way, I can't wait to watch him this season. Judging from some film that I watched, Kelly from BG could challenge also.

    ReplyDelete
  120. Jellison played against glorified pop warner teams. many good backs could put up numbers against those schools

    ReplyDelete
  121. Do you think Cannone is the Best QB

    ReplyDelete
  122. Haha 10:52! Yes, 9:09 loves his Blue Devils.

    My post had nothing to do with college if you actually read it. I said that Jellison's height wasn't the reason he went D1 over say Jacques as a counter to your point, but the rest of my post that basically became an essay was all about high school. Also, if I recall correctly Jacques had how many carries vs South and Central again? I think you pulled that 19 number out of a hat. Sean Jellison often had 200 yards and 4 TD's at half time with 8 carries and a punt return to his credit, and then sat out the second half. I know that you're from Salem and you're proud of your boys, but let's be honest with ourselves here for a bit. Even though NH football was never anything to brag about, the quality of the game has greatly been reduced since the 90s and early part of the 2000s. Runners like Jellison, Philistin (he played both ways in HS), Russett, etc faced fiercer competition and shined much brighter. In fact, I'd argue Zocco was a better back than Jacques. He was bigger and still ran a 4.5 and was a complete back. The younger Jellison even was a more complete back than Jacques, though honestly he belongs at TE. The point is that when when kid has ONE great season as a JR in a comparitively WEAK D1 last year, you can't just automatically say he's the greatest ever. That title is earned. The fact is that the Russetts, Jellisons (Sean), Philistins, Zoccos, and early 2000s Pinkerton boys faced much tougher competition and accomplished similar statistical feats, but over their four year careers, not just two like Jacques. The fact that you can't even remember the name of "the runningback that I'm plugging" proves your ignorance on the issue. How many career yards, TDs does Jacques have? What are his single game records? What are his season records? Let's have him first try and beat Russett's numbers, which were accomplished against far better competition: 4000+ yards and 60 TDs. Then maybe we can start to talk a little about Jellison at over 5000 yards and 103 TDs. Jacques is the "now" back, but in five years you'll forget his name but still remember Jellison and Russett.

    ReplyDelete
  123. Oh, I almost forgot. Russett ran for 2,600 yards as a senior at Central!!!! In a much stronger D1.

    ReplyDelete
  124. So then the target for Jacques would be 2600. But I'm certain that if he exceeds that there will be other reasons that he is not the best. So, now that you set me straight yet once again I will say this, "Jacques should have a really really good season this year but he would never even be able to carry the pads of these Russet and Jellison kids". There,you happy yet?

    ReplyDelete
  125. 12:14
    The confusion was caused on my part. What I originally meant was that he could have potentially the greatest single season ever in NH in 2010. That statement was made not knowing or caring about any NH football history. I don't think any of us know who has the most all purpose yards to date, so it probably can't be proven. He starts at CB, he returns kicks and punts also. He looks good, he could put up the greatest numbers that anyone has ever seen in NH and that statement can not be proven wrong until 2010 is over, or at least half way through it. The only thing that we will be able to go by is either Total yards, TDs or YPC for the season. And it wasn't rocket science figuring out his carries per game. I took his published(NHSPORTSPAGE.COM) carries and divided by his games played. Same for Jerickson. I went online and searched for the numbers that you are pushing for your D3 back and all that I found was his senior season. It wasn't really as impressive as what you say.(ya ya you say he was injured but the article did not mention that) While I was looking, I found that some kid from Londonderry Theodosi recently turned down an offer from the Nebraska Cornhuskers to go to Brown. This using your college theory would make him a better HS RB than the D3 kid you are plugging whose offer was from UNH. So, you see, everything has a counter argument. It is pointless to argue everything. And finally, how can I 'remember' two backs that I never heard of? I will remember Jacques for ever pretty much because the D1 ring that my son has is thanks to him. I will probably even remember a couple of his teammates for ever. I will remember some of his adversaries for a while, but I will never remember the guys you are plugging because I just have no reason to. And I would expect even you to only remember players that you actually watched. I started watching HS football in 2007 my sons freshman season and will stop after 2010 when he graduates. The only players that I have a shot of remembering I saw play during that time. Maybe 20 years down the road I'll watch another 4 years, god willing. So you see, my comments are strictly biased and pro Salem with no malice or disrecpect intended for any current or past players. But it is interesting the way people exagerrate things to promote thier players. PS, I also think that the Patriots are going 19-0 this season. That prediction may not come true either. And in closing, I enjoy this sports forum thing.

    ReplyDelete
  126. Sean Jellison's Jr year stats are on here:

    http://rivals.yahoo.com/chicagosports/football/recruiting/player-Sean-Jellison-38686

    Rivals is THE source for high school football recruit info.

    And yes, Jellison missed like 4 or 5 games his senior year, so the 14000+ yards he got didn't look that great. As a SO he had over 1600, as a Junior 2020 and 41 TDs (bad hammie at the end of the season), and then as a senior the hammie came back to wipe out half of his season and slow him down.

    Yds Avg TD Yds Tck Int
    2004 2,020 10.8 41 340 67 7

    That's what I call doing it all. 2,020 yards, 41 TDs, 10.8 ypc, 340 more in receiving yards, 67 tackles as a safety, and no less than SEVEN interceptions. They also don't factor in his kick and punt return stats, where Jellison more often than not returned it for 6. There's never been one like him in NH, and likely won't be one for a good long time.

    Then don't forget Russett's 2,600 yards as a senior. Jacques would need another 800 yards to surpass that number - not gonna happen. Also, NHSportsPage's stats are wrong on every player just about across the board. Sometimes by as much as 300 rushing yards and 10 TDs since I don't think they updated the stats after a certain point last year (Cannone, Petropulos, the younger Jellison, and Montville's stats are way off from the official school and newspaper stats). I remember Jacques got 200 and almost 300 yards in a game - a four quarter game that is where he got 40 carries!

    I know you're biased and Fedrick and Jacques are the "now" kids, but talk to anyone that has been around a while and they'll tell you all about Russett, Jellison (Sean), Philistin, the Pinkerton boys that shared a backfield and went to Holy Cross and Notre Dame, etc. I'm sorry, but Jacques is not that caliber, period. Nevertheless I'm not trashing the kid: he's a great athlete and player and I wish him the best, but sometimes people take it way too far.

    Finally, Theodosi was getting basic looks from Nebraska (mail, emails, etc.) that thousands of kids get. He may have been asked to walkon, but trust me when I say he didn't have a scholarship offer.

    ReplyDelete
  127. 10:53

    So this story is false? PS, why you picking on Theo? He has nothing to do with your argument.

    http://www.maxpreps.com/news/qi_I0RZeO0aRuf9q5JzRKg/new-hampshire--theodhosi-says-no-to-nebraska.htm

    ReplyDelete
  128. @10:53

    Sean Jellison was a very good RB, and put up some huge numbers against some average-below average defenses. If you took Pinkerton's Matt Jordan, Londonderry's Alex Theodhosi, Central's Sloan Russett or Dave Philistine, and plop them into D3, they would have put up ridiculous numbers...heck, they already put up crazy numbers playing agaist some of the biggest schools in the state. I hate to break it to you, but Jellison gets the "Plymouth" treatment - their accomplishments are minimized because of the competition in the division, plain and simple. You can try to rationalize his stats all you want, but nothing can change the fact that they came against some pretty unimpressive defenses.

    But like I said, he was a very good RB in NH. Jacques may prove to be even better though.

    Only time will tell...

    ReplyDelete
  129. Anyone saying that "D 3 is weaker than D 4 these days" is absolutely delusional. Put Souhegan in D 4 and they roll to a state title. Put Plymouth in D3 and they take at least 2 losses, ending the streak.

    ReplyDelete
  130. Jellison is at UNH... remember!

    ReplyDelete
  131. 1:14, D3 used to be extremely competitive and strong. I know you said that you've only followed high school ball since 2007 so it's hard for you to think back that far, but in those days Plymouth, Souhegan, Kennett, and Milford were EXTREMELY talented. Today's Plymouth, Kennett, and Milford are mere shadows of their former selves 8-10 years ago. Only Souhegan has gotten stronger over the past few years. All of those teams: the old Plymouth dynasty, Ginnard's Kennett (or whatever the QB at Kennett's name was), Mack and O'Brien's Milford, and Jellison/Lapham/Verney/Conti's Souhegan were right up there with the best teams in the state. Granted, Schubert's Central was by far the machine in the state, but those four teams were D1 playoff caliber, no doubt.

    Let's not forget that Jellison was not just a product of a "weak" division (in actuality an extremely difficult and competitive division at the time), but was a D1 talent who had serious interest from schools like UConn before injuries ruined the end of his career and he committed to UNH, the number 9 team in FCS football.

    Jellison had an extra gear and running vision that nobody had seen before in NH, and likely won't for some time. After him, the likes of Russett, Philistin (no 'e' at the end), the Pinkerton boys, and maybe even Jeff Mack deserve places ahead of Jacques, who's had ONE GOOD SEASON. The others I mentioned were four year starters and 1000 yard rushers multiple times over that career. Let's see Jacques beat Russett's 2600, Jellison's 5000+, Jellison's 41 TDs (and 7 INTs), Jellison's 2020 yards in a half of football each week, etc. 1800 yards and 20-something TDs in even back to back years does not compare. Jacques had 700 yards or something as a SO, Jellison had 1600 as a SO.

    As for Theodhosi, I don't put him on the level of the Jellison,Russett, Philistin, Pinkerton boys level because he basically got his 2000 yards playing 4 quarters of football in a MUCH weaker D1 with often 40+ carries a game in Londonderry's then weird Tebow offense. However, Theodosi also belongs ahead of Jacques for now, even though he was a one season wonder.

    The point is that the "now" guy isn't necessarily the best of all time just because you can't think back that far. I'm sure if you asked Max himself he'd laugh and shrug when asked if he thinks he's on that level. I'm sorry but you can't annoint him greatest of all time after one good season in a WEAK D-I last year. That's just disrespectful to the Jellisons, Russetts, Philistins, Macks, and Theodohsis of the world.

    ReplyDelete
  132. jeremy u going fri jamboree?

    ReplyDelete
  133. May have been a weak D-I FOR D-I, but it's still better than D-III has ever been as an entire division, and if you even try to argue that, you are very unintelligent.

    I am not the guy that you have been arguing with, by the way, I've just been reading it.

    ReplyDelete
  134. Ryan Mihalko was a tremendous special teamer for the '88 Notre Dame team that won the national title; Joe Segretti went to Holy Cross, Matt Jordan to UMass. Former Central coach Jim Schubert played @Wake Forest. His brother Steve went to UMass and played for Pats and Bears (teammate of Walter Payton.) Bishop Bradley (now Trinity) QB Mark Telge of the 60's played @Duke. Nashua's Greg Landry (Umass and Lions.) Spaulding's Paul Frase (Syracuse and Jets. Central's Don Sarette QB'd Syracuse to national title with Ernie Davis.

    ReplyDelete
  135. D-IV is better top to bottom than D-III

    ReplyDelete
  136. 7:47, the top echelon of D-III in Jellison's JR year (2004) was superior to last year's D-I. NH was extremely weak last year, and D-I especially so as D-II was actually stronger. No, I'm not "unintelligent," but thank you. Just because I don't have an obvious bias and I have an open mind and have actually SEEN the players and teams being discussed over the past 10 years does not make me unintelligent, it makes me honest. To give you an idea, go to NH's Scout.com page if you will. Notice the fact that ever since 2006 there's been next to no D1 caliber players out of NH after we consistently have 4-5 a year and about 7 or so 1AA kids as well. This is indicitive of how weak NH has become. D-III back then had at any given time had 4 D1 level recruits, more than the state had this year total I believe. If you don't believe me, see Lapham, Jellison, both Boyle brothers, etc. I happen to have been around for a while and seen it all. Have you?

    ReplyDelete
  137. "I know you said that you've only followed high school ball since 2007 so it's hard for you to think back that far, but in those days Plymouth, Souhegan, Kennett, and Milford were EXTREMELY talented."

    1) If I only started following NH football in '07, how would I know how dominant Jordan was at Pinkerton, back in the eary 90's? I still remember when he was in Sports Illustrated. And at the time, there was simply no argument that D1 was the cream of the crop in NH football. He was breaking records against the best NH had to offer at the time.

    2) You're biased which is why you have this delusion that D3 is on par with D1. If you said D2 was on par with D1 I'd be more likely to agree. But not D3. Maybe Plymouth, Souhegan, and Kennett were "EXTREMELY" talented...for D3, but they weren't on par with the Central's, Pinkerton's, BG's, or even Exeter's of the mid 2000's. That's just the way it is. Actually, I take that back, Mike Boyle's Plymouth was up there with those teams...but that's it.

    "Let's not forget that Jellison was not just a product of a "weak" division (in actuality an extremely difficult and competitive division at the time), but was a D1 talent who had serious interest from schools like UConn before injuries ruined the end of his career and he committed to UNH, the number 9 team in FCS football."

    Dave Philistin was recruited by the University of Maryland as well as Ohio State, Michigan, Boston College, and West Virginia (http://www.umterps.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/philistin_dave00.html), and he was arguably a better RB than he was a LB. He was simply a freak of nature. But Sloan Russett was even better.

    "Jellison had an extra gear and running vision that nobody had seen before in NH, and likely won't for some time."

    Obviously you never saw Russett play. And Mike Boyle also had ridiculous speed/vision. And as far as extra gears go, have you seen BG's Mike Kelly yet? You might just want to speak for yourself when you say "nobody had seen it before in NH, and likely won't for some time".

    "Jacques had 700 yards or something as a SO, Jellison had 1600 as a SO."

    Jacques was splitting carries 3 ways...just like he did last season. And he was doing it against better competition (no matter how much you try to deny it). He'll be splitting carries again this season with Federick (who may end up being the best when all is said and done).

    "As for Theodhosi, I don't put him on the level of the Jellison,Russett, Philistin, Pinkerton boys level because he basically got his 2000 yards playing 4 quarters of football in a MUCH weaker D1 with often 40+ carries a game in Londonderry's then weird Tebow offense."

    It's called the Single Wing, and obviously you'd never get a job coaching at the University of Nebraska because they disagree with you (which is why they offered him). Also, the fact that he had to play 4 quarters is proof that teams were way more competitive.

    "I'm sorry but you can't annoint him greatest of all time after one good season in a WEAK D-I last year."

    I'm not annointing Jacques the greatest of all time. There are a few names who are in contention (not necessarily including him), and none of them are named Sean Jellison. It's actually comical that you include him in the conversation. You must be a Souhegan grad/parent/player, which would explain your bias. And it's ok to be biased...just admit it.

    Your whole argument is based on the fact that D3 was on par with D1...and that's simply not true. I think most objective people on this website understand this. You're simply not being objective.

    With all this being said, again, Jellison was a fine NH running back - just not on that next level like you seem to think he was.

    ReplyDelete
  138. Philistin went to Maryland, albeit not as a runningback, while Jellison went to UNH. I'd say Philistin overshadows Jelly.

    ReplyDelete
  139. 6:19
    Not that you had much to begin with, but you lost all credibility when you posted "but trust me when I say he didn't get a scholarship offer" about Theodhosi.

    ReplyDelete
  140. Why do you keep makig up numbers about Jacques. Here is the line for his 267 yard day. Hardly 40 Carries.

    INDIVIDUAL LEADERS

    RUSHING: S (42-517) – Max Jacques 22-267, Jerickson Fedrick 14-224, Alex Sobrado 3-20, Rick LaRhette 1-8, Matt Cannone 2-(-2); N (44-248) – Jamar Gathright 20-95, Brandon Karkhanis 6-30, Dylan Brodeur 18-123
    PASSING: S – Cannone 3-5-0, 83; N – Karkhanis 15-28-1, 177, Brodeur 3-4-1, 54

    RECEIVING: S – Mike Lorenz 1-33, Jake Mathews 1-33, Kyle Henrick 1-17




    http://www.rallynorth.net/localsports/teams/story/5897?story_id=6356

    ReplyDelete
  141. And here is the line on his 331 yard day, again far from 40 carries. You really need to stop posting lies.

    INDIVIDUAL LEADERS

    RUSHING: Salem (52-435) — Max Jacques 21-331, Jericson Fedrick 17-81, Alex Sobrado 8-21, Matt Cannone 5-2, Darren Brown 1-2; Nashua South (29-161) — Derek Paradis 13-83, Armond McRae 8-78, Keith Farkas 8-0

    PASSING: Salem — Cannone 3-8-0, 53; Nashua South — Farkas 18-31-1, 236

    RECEIVING: Salem — Kyle Henrick 2-42, Mike Lorenz 1-11; Nashua South — Nick Haskell 6-103, McRae 4-27, Nilsson Basora 4-26, Paradis 2-22, Nick Fredericksen 1-46, Nick Puleo 1-12


    http://www.rallynorth.net/localsports/teams/story/5898?story_id=6199

    ReplyDelete
  142. This is RB argument is getting really old. Does anyone want to blog about this year?

    ReplyDelete
  143. Never thought I would say this,but these salem bloggers make the bg people look humble.

    ReplyDelete
  144. I believe 6:30 is saying old as in stale and I agree. Salem has won one championship in the last 25 years and the Salem posters act like it has never been done before. It's great to be excited by the team and the players but how about a little objectivity and variety of analysis, so we can keep it interesting.

    ReplyDelete
  145. Haha, I know 3:20, I know. First BG thinks they're the best team ever, then Salem thinks they have the best backfield talent ever. It's funny how each year the top team in the state has "the best ever." Can't wait to see who the preseason favorite, and thus "best ever" players/teams are next year!

    Sean, not Steven Jellison, Russett, Philistin (who played RB in HS), Pinkerton kids, Mack, Theodohsi > Jacques and Fedrick. Actually, Steven Jellison is number 2 in state history for career TDs so actually he even belongs ahead of Jacques and Fedrick. Then there's also Viera, number 3. So, Jellisons, Russett, Philistin, Pinkerton kids (Holy Cross and Notre Dame kids), Mack, Theodohsi, and Viera are to this point better all time NH backs than Jacques and Fedrick at this point. We'll see after this season where Jacques falls, and after next year where Fedrick falls, but I guarantee it's behind Sean Jellison, Russett, Philistin, and the Pinkerton tandem.

    ReplyDelete
  146. Manchester Jamboree:
    Goffstown 8
    Salem 7

    ReplyDelete
  147. salem lost to gtown 8-7.there endith the lesson..

    ReplyDelete
  148. I went to the freshmen jamboree and i thought that tevor knight was very impressive. But if souhegan is so good why wouldnt he go there?

    ReplyDelete
  149. I saw Kelly at the Jamboree tonight. He is very very talented. However, he seems too light to be pounding it into the hole like they tried to do with him. With each and every hit it took him longer and longer to get up. He pulled himself out of the game multiple times. BG needs to move him back to the wing. I realize that he will not play many teams that hit as hard as Pinkerton, but still, they are using him incorrectly.

    ReplyDelete
  150. Central pounded Timberlane and Pinkerton in a boring game beat BG with starters playing most of game for both teams. BG does not look at good as last year but did move the ball ok. What else happened?

    ReplyDelete
  151. 9:36, where do I start?

    Look up every career record for rushing and scoring in NH. Now look at the name you find right next to it. You'll see the name Sean Jellison.

    It's fine that we disagree over who the greatest in NH history was/is, I'm open to debate. If we're looking at merely how they were in HS, Jellison was a far more dominant rusher than Philistin was. Sure, Philistin went higher in college and is currently a practice squad guy in Seattle right now I believe, but as far as high school goes Jellison was the most dominant force at RB that the state has ever seen.

    No, I'm not biased at all actually for or against Souhegan. As you will recall I actually was the first person on here to even MENTION the names Sloan Russett, Dave Philistin, Jeff Mack, BOTH Boyle brothers, the Pinkerton boys, etc. Speaking of the Boyles, they were both QBs in HS so I don't know why you used them in your argument at all. I'd also say with confidence that Jellison was faster than Boyle, Kelly, Jacques, Fedrick, etc. Not only have I seen them all play, but I've also got their times. Jacques and Kelly are slower than Fedrick according to track times, and Fedrick ran a 4.7 forty at the Bentley combine. At State College Nike Football Training Camp Jellison ran an OUTSTANDING 4.44 LASER TIMED forty in the summer before his senior season. Not even Boyle was ever that fast. However, Jellison also had that vision to see lanes that weren't there, but yet they were for him and him alone. Did YOU ever see Jellison play? I saw all of the names discussed play and in my opinion Jellison was the best HS runningback I've ever seen come out of NH.

    Again, it's fine for us to disagree though! However, this started as a Jacques discussion and it seems that we might just be in agreement that there are rushers that belong ahead of the name Max Jacques. I agree in that all the names you mentioned (plus Jellison) deserve recognition. I think they are higher up the list than Jacques by miles as well.

    Now it's my turn to quote:

    "It's called the Single Wing, and obviously you'd never get a job coaching at the University of Nebraska because they disagree with you (which is why they offered him). Also, the fact that he had to play 4 quarters is proof that teams were way more competitive."

    I'm not asking for a job at Nebraska, thank you. The offense Londonderry ran was 2 tights with TWO wings I believe (making it the DOUBLE wing, no?) with Theodohsi back in the Shotgun (like Tebow), where they ran wedge (oh man, I guess I do know my football!) 40 times a game with a direct snap to Theodohsi who'd bull his way for five yards. And the fact that Theodohsi played 4 quarters a game does not mean that D-I was that much more competitive... it means that Londonderry wasn't a very good team. Theodohsi single-handedly CARRIED that team to the playoffs his senior year. Without him in they would have been out of the playoffs with a losing record like a Memorial or Concord. However, I can't put his name up there with the legends because he only had one good season, and it took him 40 carries a game to get there.

    To be continued...

    ReplyDelete
  152. Continued...

    "Jacques was splitting carries 3 ways...just like he did last season. And he was doing it against better competition (no matter how much you try to deny it). He'll be splitting carries again this season with Federick (who may end up being the best when all is said and done)."

    Perhaps you never watched the old Jellison era Souhegan play, but they also ran the same Wing T that Salem runs. Jellison played on the Wing with Verney at FB and I forget the name of the RB. He was lucky to get 10 carries a game IF THAT on his way to 300 yards and 4 TDs by halftime of each game. I know we disagree here, but 10 years ago NH football was different. It was strong. D-III back then was better than D-I now. And D-I back then was beyond today's kids' comprehension. Football was just BETTER back then. Don't deny it, the past 4 years NH has gotten much weaker as kids go off to prep schools and talent peters out, etc. So yes, D-I in Jellison's day was stronger than his D-III, but his D-III was also stronger than today's D-I, and the top 4 teams in D-III then were capable of playing with anyone in NH besides perhaps that Little Green machine, whom no one could really play with anyway. And I'm sorry but I just have too much respect for Jellison, Russett, Philistin, the Pinkerton boys, etc. to even mention that Fedrick could even TOUCH their greatness. They played much tougher competition and were 4 year starting multi-year 1000 yard rushers. I can't bring myself to do it. Finally, my comment was about how Jellison's 1600 yards was greater than Jacques' 700 as a sophomore. Me thinks 900 yards difference (200 yards more than double Jacques' production) reflects more on the backs than your ill-conception of D-I's strength when in actuality it's weak.
    "Obviously you never saw Russett play"

    I did, many times. Notice I was the one who first mentioned him and his feats - such as his 2600 yard season. 'Obviously you like making assumptions.'

    Again, Philistin was a great player and a better college recruit than Jellison could ever be as a 5-9 175 lbs white running back from NH(Philistin was much bigger, no injury concerns, different position, etc.), but the fact that Jellison was able to get where he is now and that he was actually getting the BC and UConn looks before injuries took him out speaks loudly about his ability on the field and production in high school. Strictly as a high school player (not college recruit), Jellison was a better HS running back than Philistin. Let's not forget that you can be a great HS player or even the best ever in NH and NOT get the big time scholarship offers because college IS NOT high school. Speed is king, true, but size is a prerequisite and Jellison didn't match the mold, and had injury concerns.

    To Be Continued...

    ReplyDelete
  153. Continued Again.

    "You're biased which is why you have this delusion that D3 is on par with D1. If you said D2 was on par with D1 I'd be more likely to agree. But not D3. Maybe Plymouth, Souhegan, and Kennett were "EXTREMELY" talented...for D3, but they weren't on par with the Central's, Pinkerton's, BG's, or even Exeter's of the mid 2000's. That's just the way it is. Actually, I take that back, Mike Boyle's Plymouth was up there with those teams...but that's it."

    No, I'm not delusional. Today's D-III is nowhere near D-IV, D-II, or D-I. D-III nowadays is a joke. It's Souhegan and then a bunch of JV teams. Ten years ago was much different. Different kids, different teams, different everything. D-III in Jellison's era was stronger than today's D-I. NH has just gotten weaker, admit it. Go to that Scout.com link I mentioned and check it out for yourself. NHs two D1A commits last year came out of prep schools. The best players in the NHIAA went to D2 and the second-rate FCS conference the NEC where in years past they went to BC, UConn, Syracuse, Army, Northwestern, etc. I'm glad you see that Boyle's Plymouth team belonged with the greats of the day. Too bad Souhegan, Kennett, and Milford were competitive with the old Plymouth teams, even if they did usually lose. In fact, in 2004 KENNETT beat Plymouth to a pulp when they played if I recall. Those four teams were supremely talented and could have played with your Pinkerton's, BG's, and Exeters. Central, I don't know. Even Pinkerton often got rolled by the Little Green so I put Central on a whole other level entirely. Point is, yesteryear's D-III was more competitive than today's D-I. Periood.

    ") If I only started following NH football in '07, how would I know how dominant Jordan was at Pinkerton, back in the eary 90's? I still remember when he was in Sports Illustrated. And at the time, there was simply no argument that D1 was the cream of the crop in NH football. He was breaking records against the best NH had to offer at the time."

    I'm sorry I mistook you to be that guy who said he only started following football in 2007 when his son hit Salem High as a FR. I apologize. Notice I again was the first to mention the outstanding "Pinkerton boys" as I call them ahead of Jacques.

    I'm glad we're in agreement that saying Jacques can even be in the discussion is basically herecy, haha. I just happen to have a different opinion over who WAS number 1. Again, I have no real bias other than for talent that I've seen over the years, and the best runner I've ever seen in NH over my time following NH high school ball was Sean Jellison, period. From the sounds of it you never watched him or maybe only saw some TV highlights. You missed out. There's a reason he owns every record NH has. Having said that, I appreciate the talent of the Russetts and so on, but I have my opinion, and the record books agree with me along with many in NH who took the time in the fall to head out to see him play 5-8 years ago. I love the debate, but let's just remember to keep it respectful. Sorry for the length Jeremy, but he had a lot for me to think about there!

    ReplyDelete
  154. "But if souhegan is so good why wouldnt he go there?"

    His father is the head coach at South. I think we can fairly say he didn't skip out on SHS because they aren't that good and can't place kids in college, which they do with incredible regularity each year. It's because his Dad's the coach and once Farkas leaves he'll be starting as a Sophomore for a D-I program in NH. Easy as that.

    ReplyDelete
  155. Knight wouldn't play varsity until his senior year at Souhegan. He would be behind 2 other qb's. One being a coachs' son and we all know how that story goes.
    He has a better shot at South.

    ReplyDelete
  156. to say d3 of ten years ago was better than d1 now does not make sense. because it had few good players does not make it better top to bottom.

    ReplyDelete
  157. But it was stronger. You have to have been there to remember those teams. Souhegan was more than just Jellison, just like Plymouth was more than just Boyle, Milford more than just Mack, etc. The division was extremely strong as the TEAMS had tremendous talent outside of the superstars.

    And did you really watch D1 last year? It was a two horse race the entire year with absolutely no competition whatsoever until that Central shocker in the last week of the regular season. The last 7 teams were a definite knotch or two below Salem and North, who actually would have been punished by the old Plymouth dynasty (the new one is a sham hiding in D-IV). Overall, D1 had ZERO depth this year. D2 had all the depth as teams that missed the playoffs like Dover played with or beat playoff teams all season long. D1 was weak, and 10 years ago high school football in NH was as a whole stronger. That D3 was better than last year's D1, hands down.

    ReplyDelete
  158. 10 years down the road someone will be saying how tough 2009 D1 was compared to everything else. It's all heresay 10 years later.

    ReplyDelete
  159. @11:06, and 11:08...

    "Look up every career record for rushing and scoring in NH. Now look at the name you find right next to it. You'll see the name Sean Jellison."

    Sean Jellison had the fortune of being a good NH RB whose parents happened to live in Amherst. As a result of where his parents chose to live, he played for Souhegan High School, a Division III team that plays other Division III teams. Division III schools have smaller student enrollments, so they have less students to choose from when fielding a team. Because there are less students, there is a smaller chance of finding quality players (hence D-linemen that weigh less than 200lbs, and RB's that weigh 140, etc.). So fortunately for Jellison, he happend to be a big fish in a small pond. Just out of curiosity, what do you think Jordan, Russett, Philistin, Jeff Ragoza, Dan Prunier, or Kyle McCallister would have done in D3? They all put up nice numbers in the higher divisions around the same time that Jellison was "shattering records", so my guess is they would have expanded on their numbers if they played at SHS during their times.

    Your entire stance is based on the premise that D3 was on par with D's 1 and 2 from the fall of 2002 until the fall of 2005. That's the only way Sean Jellison could be in the conversation. But IMHO, that's where your argument falls apart, and why I just cannot place him at the top of all the NH RB's that have ever played football in the state. Unfortunately for him, his stats (that you keep throwing around) came against lower tier teams in the state (notice I didn't say "lowest tier").

    "Those four teams [Souhegan, Kennett, Milford, and Plymouth] were supremely talented and could have played with your Pinkerton's, BG's, and Exeters. Central, I don't know."
    Let's take a look the Pinkerton's, BG's, Exeter's (and i'll throw Central in there too just because you seemed to be on the fence with them) during the 2002-2005 seasons:
    2002 (Jellison's Freshman season) - D1 State Champs = CENTRAL (Runner-Up = CONCORD) , D2 State Champs = EXETER (Runner-Up = DOVER)
    2003 (Jellison's Sophomore season) - D1 State Champs = CENTRAL (Runner-Up = NASHUA) , D2 State Champs = EXETER (Runner-Up = WINNACUNNET)
    2004 (Jellison's Junior season) - D1 State Champs = CENTRAL (Runner-Up = PINKERTON) , D2 State Champs = BG (Runner-Up = WINNACUNNET)
    2005 (Jellison's Senior season) - D1 State Champs = PINKERTON (Runner-Up = SALEM) , D2 State Champs = BG (Runner-Up =EXETER)
    These teams (and the teams they faced) produced no less than five 1A players (Rob Getek '03 - BG/UCONN, Chris Scaron '03 - Salem/Buffalo, Dave Philistin '04 - Central/Maryland, Mark Spinney - BG/BC, and Kendell Reyes Nashua North/UCONN [both Spinney and Reyes were contributing Jr's during the'05 season which is included during Jellison's "reign" over D3, and increased the difficulty of playing in D's 1 and 2]).
    These teams also included no less than seven 1AA players (Matt Farbotko '02 - BG/Harvard, Sean Nolan '02 - Exeter/Colgate, Nick Couturier '03 - Dover/UNH, Sloan Russett '04 - Central/UMASS, Bryan Ferris '05 - Pinkerton/Yale, Tom Mante '05 - BG/Yale, Zach Owens '05 - Exeter/Cornell, Ryan Cronin '05 [Jr.] Winnacunnet/Marist).
    Of these players, 2 have played in the NFL (Farbotko, and Philistin), and a third has a pretty good chance (Reyes).
    So I'd say D1 and D2 weren't too shabby during the time that Jellison was setting his records. I feel pretty confident in saying that he'd have a little less running room against a tougher schedule than the one he faced in D3.

    ...

    ReplyDelete
  160. ...

    "Speaking of the Boyles, they were both QBs in HS so I don't know why you used them in your argument at all."
    That was in response to your claim that you had never seen vision like that of Jellison's before in NH football. My point was that Boyle had superior vision...a lot of guys had superior vision. If you meant "vision for RB's" then I'd still say Jordan and Russett were better.
    "Did YOU ever see Jellison play?"
    Of course. I wouldn't have even engaged in this conversation if I hadn't. But I also saw the other players that I've mentioned play...and I was more impressed by them.
    Moving on...
    "The offense Londonderry ran was 2 tights with TWO wings I believe (making it the DOUBLE wing, no?) with Theodohsi back in the Shotgun (like Tebow), where they ran wedge (oh man, I guess I do know my football!)."
    You're being too literal. If you asked anyone who is familiar with the Offensive Scheme Londonderry runs, they'd tell you it's the "Single Wing" - not necessarily meaning that they used "a 'single' Wingback", but because it's based on direct snaps to any of 1-3 different backs, along with the occasional Up/"Sniff" Back who aligns just behind the Center in either A-gap. In some instances they had 1 wingback...in other instances they had two...in some they had none. And the "Wedge" is simply one play out of that scheme. They ran lots of other plays besides that (oh man, I guess I have some idea of what I'm talking about too, huh?), so to say they ran it 40 times a game is just false.
    "And the fact that Theodohsi played 4 quarters a game does not mean that D-I was that much more competitive... it means that Londonderry wasn't a very good team."
    If D1 wasn't competitive then Londonderry would have walked through their schedule, Theodohosi would have racked up his yards early, and been out of the game before halftime week after week (like Jellison). But that season Londonderry lost to the eventual state champ (Pinkerton), lost to the eventual runner-up (South) twice, and had a wtf game against West. I hate to break it to you, but they were a pretty good team (and D1 had a few D1AA players that season...Seamus O'Neil from Central, Josh Lane from Pinkerton, David Zocco from South among others).

    ...

    ReplyDelete
  161. ...

    "D-III back then was better than D-I now."
    I have a feeling you're going to eat those words by November...
    "And D-I back then was beyond today's kids' comprehension. Football was just BETTER back then. Don't deny it, the past 4 years NH has gotten much weaker as kids go off to prep schools and talent peters out, etc."
    I agree.
    "I just have too much respect for Jellison, Russett, Philistin, the Pinkerton boys, etc. to even mention that Fedrick could even TOUCH their greatness."
    I have no idea what Federick is going to do over the next two seasons, but currently, based on what he did last spring at the Nike Combine, his 97.35 Sparq rating puts him up there as a solid FBS prospect. You can deny is all you want, but as of right now he has the attention of some BCS schools. Who knows if he'll be able to maintain their attention, but for right now, as a Jr., he's on the radar (regardless of his So. stats).
    "Jellison was a better HS running back than Philistin."
    We'll never know, but I have a hunch that is you inserted Philistin into that SHS offense in place of Jellison, you would have seen some pretty insane numbers. Just a hunch though....
    "the best runner I've ever seen in NH over my time following NH high school ball was Sean Jellison, period."
    That's your opinion, and your entitled to it. My opinion is that you are flat wrong.
    "the old Plymouth dynasty (the new one is a sham hiding in D-IV)."
    THANK YOU!!! THIS is my point. Plymouth has racked up the "nations longest winning streak" but they haven't done it against anyone. This is the EXACT same argument that goes againt Jellison and his "records". If you want to BE the best you have to PLAY the best. Neither Plymouth nor Jellison have done so. End of story.
    Again, with all this being said, Jellison was a good NH RB, no doubt about it. He's a FCS player, and he;s going to be a factor for UNH. But IMO he's just not at the top of the heap. Is he above the Salem RB's? Maybe. But the best of all time? No way.

    ReplyDelete
  162. 6:57 u r saying division 1 with a pool of about 25,000 students is not as good as division 3 of 10 years ago with pool of about 6000 students. Sorry with those numbers no way. That's not to say 5 to 6 players as good from d3 but overall with those numbers no way.

    ReplyDelete
  163. 11:48, your logic makes no sense. Souhegan with an enrollment of 840 kids had a consensus top 3 team last year. It's more than just a numbers game by chance. You have to look deeper than that (11:19 and his previous posts could take note of this too). Youth programs, feeder teams, strong systems, offseason programs, coaching, etc have a huge impact on which teams succeed and which fail. For instance, Souhegan has its own Pop Warner team (Amherst Patriots), then in middle school there's the SVS Sabers where the kids are basically prepped for the HS with the same playbook (and sometimes coaches) as the high school as they prepare to make the jump to HS. Then in the HS after they've been prepped with the SVS Sabers and played together since they were 7, they begin the high school system of offseason lifting, running, running routes, etc. Those kids never stop and it's because of the youth and feeder league setup and coaching decisions that they are able to mold so many great players for such a small school. If you want to read into it, the senior class this year had 7 college players in it: 1 D1AA, 2 D2, 4 D3 (Jellison had a full ride at UNH and the others had opportunites at D2 but chose the SCHOOL not the program).

    Now, this isn't me just kissing up to Souhegan as an alum (which I'm not). It's just an example. The point here is that Plymouth (Plymouth Huskies, etc.) do the same thing. Milford did the same thing as they used to be in the SVS Sabers program themselves before starting the Milford Mustangs. Kennett? Same thing. It's not just the numbers, it's the SET UP. Lots of these bigger schools have no feeder programs or real way to develop players at a young age to fit the system and have the same kids playing together for 11 years because with their huge numbers it becomes to much to organize and put together. So, in HS they're forced to try and do the numbers game to find their talent while the old D-III powers had no need to find out what they had. That's why D-III back then (when NH was stronger) was superior to D-I now. I can tell you right now that Salem doesn't have the support system from youth on up that those smaller schools do/did. THAT'S the difference, not just school enrollment figures. You're actually bein a bit too literal

    ReplyDelete
  164. Salem Rams have Youth teams that start at 7 years old. They have Middle school teams (JV and Varsity Unlimiteds) that work with the HS. I am not sure what you mean referring to Salem not having a Youth support system. A majority of the starting players on this Senior Class played Salem Youth football.

    ReplyDelete
  165. Manchester, Derry, Hampton, Dover, Exeter, and Timberlane all have youth programs too if I'm not mistaken (just to name a few more).

    Souhegan isnt the only program developing players at a young age. So to say that some of the bigger schools don't have feeder programs is not necessarily true. Maybe some areas don't, but their kids just play for other teams that are close to where they live.

    Just wanted to throw that out there.

    ReplyDelete
  166. Steve Miller who played at Londonderry in the late 90's should be in the conversation about the best RB in NH history. He put up monster numbers even though he rarely played in the 2nd half of games.

    ReplyDelete
  167. They don't have the same thing though. The Souhegan, Plymouth, and so on system works HAND IN HAND with the HS. For example, the Derry Wolverines and Demons run their own thing. The SVS Sabers have the same name, similar uniforms, same coaches, same plays, same philosophy, same players, not weight limits. It's basically an extension of the HS. The Manchester Bears service all 3 Manchester Schools. Salem Rams are Pop Warner (where's the feeder team in middle school like that of Souhegan and Plymouth?). You see what I mean? When the kids hit the HS in say Amherst or Plymouth, there's no adjustment and the coaches know exactly what they have to work with since for all intents and purposes the Junior High program was like a sub-FR team for the HS.

    ReplyDelete
  168. Salem Rams haven't been Pop Warner for years. They work with the HS and have middle school unlimiteds. Dude, SHS did not corner the market on feeder systems, really.

    ReplyDelete
  169. 10:56 if these feeder systems are so good why don t they play in a higher division? If it is not about the numbers step up and play someone.

    ReplyDelete
  170. SV Sabers do not have Souhegan coaches coaching them. The coaches are parents of the players. As a former parent of a SV Saber, I never even saw a hs coach at any game or any practice. The success of the Amherst Patriots and SV Sabers are due to the athletic kids and the Dads who volunteer their time.

    ReplyDelete
  171. I'm pretty sure they've had coaches coach SVS who before were at the HS, and the guy who runs it is a coach at the HS, and the head coach is at games often, and the coaches who aren't from the HS learn everything directly from the HS guys. So, same difference.

    Again, let's not make this a Souhegan discussion. I used this just as an example. Schools like Plymouth and Milford do the same thing so let's not make this a "Souhegan" discussion as there's too many of those honestly.

    ReplyDelete
  172. http://www.wmur.com/sports/24827335/detail.html

    What do you know? Sean Jellison all time NH FNF football captain. Notice they didn't put Russett there. Best RB in NH state history hands down. Some nice highlights there too.

    ReplyDelete
  173. how do you figure??? how many carries did he get when he played?? how close were the football games when he played?? honestly Ive seen backs that have racked up a ton of yards but were never really that good because they had 20-40 carries every game. josh mcglaughlin from alvirne had over 2000 yards and was a good back but he wasnt even in the same field as miller was. divisions have a big deal on comparing one player to another there is no way jellison is better then miller or jordan i dont care if he scored 200 touchdowns it doesnt matter. the competition is and was terrible.

    ReplyDelete